i am jumping off the bridge

Ice wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>the dude wrote:</div>i am jumping off the bridge

It must be opposite day. @Dude is already done with Manziel after being such a stalwart supporter, and I’m gonna be the one that is preaching patience and restraint. I don’t like Johnny, that’s no secret. Still, I don’t think QB is the biggest problem with our offense. The biggest problem bar none is our inability to run the ball successfully. Without a run game, we put all the pressure on the QB to win the game for us and that’s not a recipe for success. The Browns were built to be a power run team with a solid defense. Without the power run we’re nothing. Like Bernie Kosar and Coach Pettine said, it doesn’t matter who’s at QB if we can’t run the ball.
I think we should judge Manziel on a game where we do support him with a nice ground effort. I’m not thrilled about his potential but we should at least give him a realistic chance before we toss him in the dumpster.

My opinion has always been the same with the Browns and actually they are following through with it this year. We make real poor decisions on the QB situation. Hoyer is garbage – the quicker that the people lingering on to him realize he will not be in Cleveland and will not be a starting QB next year, the quicker we can put this experiment behind us.

We have to see what we have in Manziel now – the other alternative would have been to keep playing Hoyer which is worthless and then play Manziel a full season next year. So we can see in one game how garbage Manziel is. He still has two more games to prove to us that his arm isn’t junk.

the reason i am wanting to jump off the bridge is because we have another bust.

MDP Sack Attack wrote:

I’m not at all and never have been a Manziel fan, but he’s a rookie who just made his first start. He’s just 22, won a Heisman,

Heisman winners since 1990:

1990 – Ty Detmer, quarterback, Brigham Young
1991 – Desmond Howard, wide receiver, Michigan
1992 – Gino Torretta, quarterback, Miami (Fla.)
1993 – Charlie Ward, quarterback, Florida State
1994 – Rashaan Salaam, running back, Colorado
1995 – Eddie George, running back, Ohio State
1996 – Danny Wuerffel, quarterback, Florida
1997 – Charles Woodson, cornerback, Michigan
1998 – Ricky Williams, running back, Texas
1999 – Ron Dayne, running back, Wisconsin
2000 – Chris Weinke, quarterback, Florida State
2001 – Eric Crouch, quarterback, Nebraska
2002 – Carson Palmer, quarterback, USC
2003 – Jason White, quarterback, Oklahoma
2004 – Matt Leinart, quarterback, USC
2005 – Reggie Bush, running back, USC
2006 – Troy Smith, quarterback, Ohio State
2007 – Tim Tebow, quarterback, Florida
2008 – Sam Bradford, quarterback, Oklahoma
2009 – Mark Ingram, running back, Alabama
2010 – Cam Newton, quarterback, Auburn
2011 – Robert Griffin III, quarterback, Baylor University
2012 – Johnny Manziel, quarterback, Texas A&M
2013. Jameis Winston, quarterback, Florida State

Evidence that the trophy is meaningless in regards to NFL output.

a first round draft slot and more hype than anyone not named LeBron in the sports world for 2014. He’s done all of that via athletic ability.

The last 2 QBs with his “star power” were Tim Tebow and Brady Quinn. Hype is meaningless.

He walked into a meat grinder last Sunday, stepped onto the field for the first time after watching his defense get completely demoralized for 8 minutes, and found himself facing a defense fighting for the playoffs, a defense which had been embarrassed by The Browns five weeks earlier, and had a week’s worth of “Johnny Football” shoved down their thoughts by the media. They tossed around the Browns’ fourth string center like he was Paul McQuistan, and got solid pressure rushing only 3 or 4 on every down… if a defense can get in your grill right at the snap while keeping 7-8 in coverage, even the best QBs will have a long day.

HE threw for 71 yards in 59 minutes and 30 seconds of the game. He was a bigger detriment to the o-line than the line was to him. Yes, there were 2 occasions where he had no chance – there were also 16 others where he bailed out and showed no pocket awareness.

He panicked, his mechanics regressed, and he went with what’s always worked for him, be it from lack if preperation, instincts, rookie jitters, or all of the above. He’s found, unquestionably, that it won’t work at this level.
It’s very common with “athletic” quarterbacks. Elway, Young, Aikman…they all had awful starts to their career as they learned what won’t work in the pros.
I’m interested to see how he looks for these last couple of games. As absolutely abysmal as he looked, in a lot of ways he wasn’t that far off. He didn’t tuck-and-run, he scrambled with his eyes down field, which is a good sign. If he can learn to be more decisive when he sees a window, and more importantly to take an extra fraction of a second to set his feet, he’ll look a hell of a lot better.

He has no arm strength for his style of football. Guys like Rodgers and Ben throw on the run without setting feet. When he doesn’t set his feet his arm is not NFL quality.

His mechanics have never been NFL quality.

The Bills gave up quickly on EJ Manuel – they may make the playoffs.

The NYJ wanted to test Geno Smith this year – how’d that turn out?

We knew very early those guys weren’t NFL quality QBs.

Johnny Manziel is the poor man’s Charlie Frye.

soup I agree with most of what you said. However, there still are some real great players on that Heisman trophy list along with one hall of famer in woodson.

this is why i tell people over and over again who put so much emphasis on first round nfl picks – the talent is so close in every aspect that I always recommend the NFL team goes with the best player for their locker room and the best player for their system.

soup wrote:

@ice 11:weeks into the regular season and he can’t make a simple 1 read decision
West gave him a run game. Have you seen the picture of Manziel handing off to Manti Teo’s girlfriend for negative 6 yards? The hole is ginormous, had he known the play West gets a huge gain.
First week all year he tried taking extra time.
What’s the point of remaining invested in a guy who isn’t invested in the team?

This.

MDP, dude, I watched the game and smashed my dick with a hammer. Repeatedly. Watching that fucking game hurt like hell.

HOWEVER, there’s no going back. They should have either- A: Put JFF in the Colts game to get him some much-needed experience (as well as getting the line in sync- how many false starts were there again?), or B: Let Hoyer finish out the season. You can’t give the ball to the rookie like he’s Jesus and expect a miracle.

This whole ordeal has thrown the offense completely out of whack, and I have to put that one on our rookie head coach.The staff had no business throwing a first start rookie out there against a division rival near the end of the season with playoff hopes on the line, especially when they’re pissed about what we did to them earlier this year.

So, now we’re stuck with the decision. It likely implies that Hoyer is gone next year no matter what. And Manziel better stop trying to play magician in the backfield and focus on what it takes to be a QB in this league, or he’s gonna be joining Brady Quinn as another failed savior of the franchise.

All this being said…if we somehow get all the pieces to fit together next year, Manziel actually playing the position instead of backyard Smear the Queer, the coaches actually look at the mistakes of this season and learn from them…combined with our two first rounders next year, we might get somewhere. I’d like to see what’s already been an improvement get better.

Because I gotta tell you, I didn’t expect 7 wins.