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Thought it was interesting that Pep Hamilton asked both players to extend their pro days by throwing wet footballs. Both QBS obliged. No idea how either went.
Freedom!!!
I peed on a football once.
That said, I think both went very well…although by all accounts, Wentz had the better showing. What’s interesting is that he over-threw his guy with one of those wet balls. So, take that as you will.
Evidently Wonderlic scores were leaked. Wentz’s was 40/50 and Goff’s was 36/50.
Not surprising as Wentz is the better student and opperated a more complex offence
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@Soup @DawgPoundDude I think we are just throwing smoke screens at this point to see if someone will trade up. I can’t imagine with the current signing we just made that we would be using a first round pick on a QB when we are in dire needs of other positions too and if there is elite talent like Bosa available, we would be morons to pass him up.
Hue Jackson is a loser.
@dude I couldn’t disagree more. IMO signing RG3 should not affect our draft plans AT ALL. If they see one of those QB’s as being worth a #2 pick they should take him and not look back. RG3 played safety on the scout team of the ‘Skins last year but he’s good enough to be our starting QB?!? If anything else that screams to me that we are desperate for a QB!
Maybe the Browns will have both Goff and Wentz come to Cleveland and throw wet footballs while inside a giant meat locker with an ambient temperature of about 10 degrees below zero. Under that scenario, I’d have to put my money on the kid that grew up in Bismarck, North Dakota and not the one that was born and raised in sunny California. Just saying.
If the Browns draft Goff, they’re getting a more slightly-built version of Tim Couch – both in size and college offensive scheme (Air Raid). If the Browns select Wentz, they’ll get a QB that has run a pro style offense for two seasons; calling his own plays in the huddle, making checks at the line and quarterbacking his way to not one – but two National Championships (albeit at the FCS level).
Am I going mad, or did the word THINK escape your lips? You were not hired for your brains, you hippopotamic landmass!
So your saying your betting on the guy you haven’t seen the other guy do it. The point of my post was that they are doing their due diligence on the matter everyone was up in arms about. BTW Aaron Rodgers who played at Cal says “hi.”
And FYI – Wentz TRUE FRESHMAN back-up went 8-0 as a starter. HE also called audibles and changed plays – he even did it in his first start when the brittle Wentz went down with injury.
Goff wasn’t in the air raid offense. It’s a variation called a BEAR raid.
“The simplicity of the system isn’t so obvious. The easiest way to explain the Bear Raid is by calling it a progression-based system rooted in concepts. Translation: Goff is asked to read defenses on every snap.………”I’ll call an average of 85 plays per game,” Franklin says. “And probably 75 to 80 of those plays will have multiple possibilities of what he can do.”
Goff realized this as soon as he arrived on campus in the spring of 2013 and immersed himself in the offense.
“We run a lot of run/pass stuff, where we have a run play and a pass play on at the same time — screens or outs on the backside of run plays,” Goff says. “The most difficult part for me was deciding when to run and when to pass, because I had never done that before.“”
Wentz pro-style offense? Are we running the read option? Because that’s essentially what he did for the B league division he played in. That’s why his highlight reel is full of runs. I believe (going from memory) when I compared him to NFL players and his run totals – he’d have been 2nd to Cam Newton in rush attempts for QB’s.
Since you refused to comment when I originally posted it – take a look at these HIGHLIGHT reels. Take a look at the sheer amount of WR adjustments by wide open Wentz receivers. Are you really that big of a Derek Anderson fan?
Wentz: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7oT3PpE_Rw
Goff: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cEGafktM5r4
Freedom!!!
Don’t sign off on Lynch yet. He’s this year’s Jay Cutler but with a much better head on his shoulders.
The more I see Goff, the less I like him @2nd overall. He looks more like a low 1st- high 2nd round guy to me.
@dude I couldn’t disagree more. IMO signing RG3 should not affect our draft plans AT ALL. If they see one of those QB’s as being worth a #2 pick they should take him and not look back. RG3 played safety on the scout team of the ‘Skins last year but he’s good enough to be our starting QB?!? If anything else that screams to me that we are desperate for a QB!
Tree could be our starting QB. Smoke screens being thrown….they need more picks.
Hue Jackson is a loser.
I think that it’s clear the Browns feel that RG3 can not only be rehabilitated, but excel. Hue Jackson is infatuated with him. His exact words during a recent interview when talking about RG3 on a roll-out pass during their workout of him was “when he moved, the Earth moved underneath him”.
Once again I find myself wishing and hoping for yet another browns reclamation project at QB. Hope aside, I’ve been pretty clear on what I think of the signing.
Make no mistake, the RG3 signing very, very much will affect the Browns thought process in the draft. Whether that is a good or bad thing is another debate unto itself. If we don’t get a QB, we’re going to be getting a stud, and I’m talking a dominant one, at another position. Be it Bosa, Myles Jack, the kid from FSU, or Zeke. So, it depends on how you want to view that.
Wentz ran the the Stanford version of the WCO. The same offence Stanford and the Colts ran when Pep Hamilton was there at both places.
NDST’s coaches went to Stanford and was actually allowed to co opt Stanford’s play books because they play at different levels.
So EVERYTHING Luck was asked to do at Stanford Wentz did at NDST.
Oh and Soup your completely wrong about the Bear raid. The same plays Couch ran at KY are still part and partial of the offence that let him be ill prepared for the NFL just like other Browns air raid QB’s namely Weeden Manziel and now RG3.
The reason why that offence was installed at NDST is the coach KNEW what he had on his hands as before he became the HC at NDST he was the DC for NDST. And the toughest QB his D went against for years was Carson Wentz befor he got his start.
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I think that it’s clear the Browns feel that RG3 can not only be rehabilitated, but excel. Hue Jackson is infatuated with him. His exact words during a recent interview when talking about RG3 on a roll-out pass during their workout of him was “when he moved, the Earth moved underneath him”.
Once again I find myself wishing and hoping for yet another browns reclamation project at QB. Hope aside, I’ve been pretty clear on what I think of the signing.
Make no mistake, the RG3 signing very, very much will affect the Browns thought process in the draft. Whether that is a good or bad thing is another debate unto itself. If we don’t get a QB, we’re going to be getting a stud, and I’m talking a dominant one, at another position. Be it Bosa, Myles Jack, the kid from FSU, or Zeke. So, it depends on how you want to view that.A 2 year deal never effected anything draft wise. Their thought is one of the following:
1. We are taking QB at #2 and he’s sitting for 2 years. If Griffin lights it up – then we have a good problem to have and can trade the back-up for a 1st.
2. We aren’t sold on a QB to take at #2 so we are going with a guy like Hogan in round 2 and he’s going to sit for 2 years. If Griffin lights it up – good – we have a solid back-up like McCaron (who I wanted in round 2 when he came out- yes I beliee he sat until round 4 – to me – Hogan I that guy this year).
It’s definitely not “We signed Griffin to a 2 year deal therefore he’s our starter for 10 years.”
Freedom!!!
Had some difficulty registering, but I’m finally able to comment, woot woot!! I was pretty pumped to find this place, TBH. There were actually times after DawgBones last season that I was envisioning Soup’s head exploding (namely, the one game where Duke killed it in the 1st half then had like 1 carry in the 2nd), but unable to read the string of rants because I didn’t know about this place. Sad but true.
Anyway, sorry for the mini hi-jack. It’s nice to see there’s still a place where Soup and DawgSoldier can present there biased, one-sided arguments proclaiming the superiority of their opinions!
As for Goff and Wentz and their pro-days, I’m so MEH on both its laughable. Don’t get me wrong, we NEED to take one of them because we can’t keep limping along with flawed QB’s taken later hoping they can overcome their glaring deficits. I just don’t have a strong opinion about either of these players.
Things like Pro-ready and running pro-style offenses lost a lot of meaning to me after Brady Quinn and Brian Robiskie were touted as the “most pro-ready” players in the draft. Give me the guy with the highest ceiling and fewest flaws.
Soup it’s hard to even continue a conversation with you when you keep using the phrase “if Griffin lights it up”.
That’s like me talking to my wife about a new house and starting off by saying “well if I get that HBO stand-up special”…….
Is it possible? Sure, sure I have to acknowledge it as possible, but we all know the truth.
A 2 year deal never effected anything draft wise.
The contract doesn’t, but bringing him in here in the 1st place surely does. They didn’t bring him in here to “see what he’s got”. They brought him here to be a starter. “The”, starter. We don’t need a veteran backup to mold and teach a new guy, we already have one of those and a pretty damn good one in mcCown. So why is he here? To check out or wonderful weather and beautiful downtown coastline? No. he’s here to be the starter. And if that’s the case, why draft a QB at 2 then? What purpose would it serve? It makes signing Griffin completely pointless then. Make no mistake, Griffin being here very much affects what we are doing in the draft.
Don’t get me wrong, I want them to draft a QB at 2 as well. But if they still do, it makes the Griffin signing the biggest waste of money and head-scratcher since clear Pepsi.
It’s definitely not “We signed Griffin to a 2 year deal therefore he’s our starter for 10 years.”
Well, i think it definitely is. Again, let’s just for the sake of argument here assume that the browns take a QB at #2.
What is Griffin’s role? Why is he here then? McCown is a far better veteran to mentor the new kid. I mean, it’s not even close nor a debate. So what is Griffin’s purpose? Do you think he signed here based on “well, we’re going to take a QB at 2, and we have McCown already, so most likely you’re gonna be the 3rd string guy”? Are you crazy? He didn’t come here for that. Or better yet, why would the browns sign Griffin with the intent of him being the bridge to the new QB taken at #2, when we already have one!!!!!!!!!!!!?? Who is cheaper, and far better suited to do so? Why?
The answer is….. they didn’t. They brought him here to be the starter. Pay no attention to this 2 year deal. it’s there so if he flames out, they can cut bait and not really be on the hook for too much, and if he excels, like the hope, they’ll tear it up and sign him to a long-term extension. In the mean time, it allows them to go in a different direction draft-wise by not having to focus on the QB position.
The Griffin signing very much affects what we’re doing in the draft. If it doesn’t, then it was just an idiotic waste of time and money. But, that’s what the browns are good at so, you may be right after all.
Shooter, I just couldn’t disagree with you more. If they had brought RGIII in to be THE guy, they wouldn’t have dicked with him during free agency. They would’ve started negotiations with his agent and not stopped until the deal was done.
But that’s not what happened. They told him “we’re wiling to offer you backup money, and maybe you start,” and then waited while he went round the league weighing his options. If you’ve got a guy you’re convinced is THE guy, you don’t let him be wined and dined all over the league!
The process itself tells me they aren’t pushing their chips in for RG3. Given that McCown is in no way the future of the franchise, I have to assume their bringing in a QB at #2. If not, the FO doesn’t place the priority on QB that it deserves and we’re already screwed, IMO.
Is it biased still if Wunkle, Mayock, Cosell…Several draft guys at ESPN and CBSSPORTS are all in agreement?
@Dawg E dawg?
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If they had brought RGIII in to be THE guy, they wouldn’t have dicked with him during free agency. They would’ve started negotiations with his agent and not stopped until the deal was done.
But that’s not what happened.
Actually, that’s exactly what happened, and exactly what they did. He came here, worked out, then stuck around, and they made him a compelling offer. Guaranteed money, heavy incentives, and a solid salary. He never went anywhere else. He visited here, stayed here, and then signed here because they did start negotiations, they didn’t let him leave, and they didn’t stop til the deal was done.
He didn’t go anywhere else. I believe there were rumors about visiting the Jets and Broncos, but Denver signed Sanchez and the Jets visit never materialized.
They told him “we’re wiling to offer you backup money, and maybe you start,” and then waited while he went round the league weighing his options. If you’ve got a guy you’re convinced is THE guy, you don’t let him be wined and dined all over the league!
They didn’t. He wasn’t wined or dined anywhere. He never left Cleveland. He never visited anyone else. There were rumors of possibly the Broncos but that never happened and they signed Sanchez, and there were rumors of the jets, but he never went there either.
He didn’t go anywhere else. They literally, literally, did what you said they should do if there interest was for him to be “the man”.
So, by your own words and criteria, um, what do ya think they brought him here for then lol?
If not, the FO doesn’t place the priority on QB that it deserves and we’re already screwed, IMO.
Now there’s a statement I’ll buy you a beer for, because we agree.
Actually, that’s exactly what happened, and exactly what they did. He came here, worked out, then stuck around, and they made him a compelling offer. Guaranteed money, heavy incentives, and a solid salary. He never went anywhere else. He visited here, stayed here, and then signed here because they did start negotiations, they didn’t let him leave, and they didn’t stop til the deal was done.
He didn’t go anywhere else. I believe there were rumors about visiting the Jets and Broncos, but Denver signed Sanchez and the Jets visit never materialized.Here’s a timeline
I thought RG3 went on other visits after the Browns, was mistaken there.But he did very much leave, he’d already visited several teams prior to the visit with the Browns, and there was almost an entire week between his Browns visit and signing the deal. That leaves a lot of time to negotiate with other teams.
Is it biased still if Wunkle, Mayock, Cosell…Several draft guys at ESPN and CBSSPORTS are all in agreement?
@Dawg E dawg?Your opinion itself isn’t biased, it’s your argument and the way you present it. Which, you just proved my point by listing only those that agree with you as if all the experts are in your corner. A quick google and I found a number of rankings with Goff ahead of Wentz (even one with Lynch ahead of both).
Oh, and some of those guys at cbssports that are in agreement: in 20 seconds I found a draft from Rob Rang that has Wentz ahead, and a draft from Pete Prisco that has Goff ahead. At ESPN, they have Wentz and Goff ranked 9 and 10 respectively, but both and a 92 overall, so it’s basically a wash.
I’m not even endorsing 1 qb over the other, just saying when you present the facts as if EVERYTHING supports your argument and you ignore the facts that contradict your argument, that’s a one-sided heavily biased argument. Thanks for making my point.
The NDSU offense is basically the Stanford version of the West Coast offense where the base formation is 22 personnel – meaning 2 TE’s and 2 RB’s – and lots of power running. They also run plays out of the spread formation with jet sweep or play action jet sweep fakes. The aspect where NDSU differs is, because of Wentz’s ability to run with the football, they’ve (over the past two seasons) added some read option and QB power run plays – particularly when inside the ten yard line.
And Soup, his freshman replacement did go 8-0, but the head coach didn’t hand over the keys to the offense like he did with Wentz. I’m confident that it will happen eventually, but it hasn’t happened yet.
Am I going mad, or did the word THINK escape your lips? You were not hired for your brains, you hippopotamic landmass!
The NDSU offense is basically the Stanford version of the West Coast offense where the base formation is 22 personnel – meaning 2 TE’s and 2 RB’s – and lots of power running. They also run plays out of the spread formation with jet sweep or play action jet sweep fakes. The aspect where NDSU differs is, because of Wentz’s ability to run with the football, they’ve (over the past two seasons) added some read option and QB power run plays – particularly when inside the ten yard line.
And Soup, his freshman replacement did go 8-0, but the head coach didn’t hand over the keys to the offense like he did with Wentz. I’m confident that it will happen eventually, but it hasn’t happened yet.He didn’t hand over the keys. However he was given the ability to audible and change plays. Wentz red shirted and then sat on the bench for 2 years before finally getting to start as a junior. He never played as a true freshman.
That said – any thoughts on those 2 highlight tapes I linked?
Also – for everyone else – anytime someone gushes over Wentz starting and winning back to back national championships – remind them that the team won 5 in a row. The first 3 Wentz was on the bench. He played for a dominating team.
Also – it’s the 2nd time I posted those highlight videos and no one has responded with their thoughts on either player from those highlights involving accuracy.
Freedom!!!
He cheated Colt McCoy is a Ninja…..well according to song he is any way. 😀
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Colt McCoy beat out RG3 on the depth chart in Washington.
That’s demoralizing.
I’m not saying that to make you sad. I’m saying we didn’t sign RG3 so that we wouldn’t have to draft a QB with our top pick. No one is hedging their bets (or their job) on the reclamation project that is Robert Griffen III.
I’m not saying that to make you sad.
Too late. It’s the truth, and the truth is sad. Griffin, is sad. The browns are sad.
I’m saying we didn’t sign RG3 so that we wouldn’t have to draft a QB with our top pick.
And I’m saying that if we didn’t, it was an incredibly nonsensical, wasteful, cog-derailing monkeywrench thrown into a team that needed something of that nature abut as much as a hooker needs a cop on her corner. If he was brought in to be a backup, we just cold-shouldered the already apt and capable one that was happy, a good leader, a great mentor, and a team guy that understood, accepted, and excelled in his role both present and future that now is probably thinkg “oh, well what the fuck? Thanks a lot”. It creates an uncomfortable QB room because make no mistake, Griffin wants to start and damn well thinks he still can, and a rookie QB taken at #2 specifically to take his job only makes that room even more awkward. Not to mention, as I have already, the gigantic pre-packaged QB controversy that is without question going to take place when this team notches it’s 3rd loss in Spetember (which it absolutely will).
So they either brought him in to be our starter, or they brought him in to be all of that^.
How very Browns-like of them.
No one is hedging their bets (or their job) on the reclamation project that is Robert Griffen III.
Well, it seems to me that they’re doubling down on that bet.
I’m not saying that to make you sad.
Too late. It’s the truth, and the truth is sad. Griffin, is sad. The browns are sad.
I’m saying we didn’t sign RG3 so that we wouldn’t have to draft a QB with our top pick.
And I’m saying that if we didn’t, it was an incredibly nonsensical, wasteful, cog-derailing monkeywrench thrown into a team that needed something of that nature abut as much as a hooker needs a cop on her corner. If he was brought in to be a backup, we just cold-shouldered the already apt and capable one that was happy, a good leader, a great mentor, and a team guy that understood, accepted, and excelled in his role both present and future that now is probably thinkg “oh, well what the fuck? Thanks a lot”. It creates an uncomfortable QB room because make no mistake, Griffin wants to start and damn well thinks he still can, and a rookie QB taken at #2 specifically to take his job only makes that room even more awkward. Not to mention, as I have already, the gigantic pre-packaged QB controversy that is without question going to take place when this team notches it’s 3rd loss in Spetember (which it absolutely will).
So they either brought him in to be our starter, or they brought him in to be all of that^.
How very Browns-like of them.No one is hedging their bets (or their job) on the reclamation project that is Robert Griffen III.
Well, it seems to me that they’re doubling down on that bet.
Their goal was to get younger.
Karlos Dansby – cut age 36
Donte Whitner – cut age 31 (July of 2016)
Josh McCown – 36 years old
RG3 – 26 years oldFreedom!!!
Their goal was to get younger.
Hoorayyyyyyy.
Their first goal should be to get better. Younger doesn’t = better.
I don’t know if anyone here is a bigger fan of McCown than I am. The dude bled for us and had 3 straight games with over 340 yards including 457 yards against the ratbirds. He does all the right things and doesn’t mind teaching his own replacement. Cleveland fans should love this guy, but I also understand that he doesn’t fit the direction we’re going. Getting younger, yes, but also getting mobile. All 3 of the top QB’s in this draft can move and are a threat to run the ball. The same can be said of RG3. I bet if all the top QB’s in this draft were pocket passers like Brady and Manning we’d still have a spot for McCown. I’d love to have him as a coach. Make him assistant QB coach and when we’re down to only 1 healthy QB on the roster (week 3?) slap a jersey on him.
Their goal was to get younger.
Hoorayyyyyyy.
Their first goal should be to get better. Younger doesn’t = better.I didn’t say what their goal should be – merely what it is. Losing Missner doesn’t bother me. He can’t tackle. That said – we certainly don’t have a replacement for him. From the way this roster is going I’m hoping Hue and Sashi were smart enough to say “don’t expect more than 1 win year one. And don’t expect more than 4 in year 2 or more than 6 in year 3.”
As a side note – the Griffin signing proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that size means zero to these guys. 6’2″ 222 LBs and 9 3/8 inch hands.
Glad to see that they aren’t size queens.
Freedom!!!
Glad to see that they aren’t size queens.
What a bizarre thing to say. “Size queens”???
Haslam’s charge since he bought the team has been ‘WIN NOW’. He wanted instant results and the results were instant. Spectacular failure. Perhaps the new brain trust has convinced him that it will take more than 1 season to build this roster. Perhaps they are building it to win in 2019. If so then it makes sense to dump the old men who won’t be there anyways. McCown won’t be there in 3 years. Dansby and Whitner won’t be there in 3 years. If you look at every move they’ve made to maximize results in 2019 regardless of how we do in 2016 then it makes a little more sense.
A little.
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