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Okay..I was REALLY hoping Hoyer would be our guy. Two things have become self evident to me:
1. Hoyer has looked very bad for a while now. His flaws are starting to completely overshadow his strengths.
2. With the AFC being so tight, I think we are now out of the playoffs. Too many teams with winning records.
Now is the time to see if Manziel is our qb. If we wait too long, we won’t really have enough sample size to determine our draft strategy this upcoming draft.
I don’t like the guy (Manziel) off the field. I don’t really have an opinion on the field because we have only see a small sample size with flashes of excitement and thuds of disappointment.
My challenge to you is this:
Give me reasons why Hoyer should still be our starter, but still protect the team’s future and upcoming draft.I know that this is the step-brother of another thread:
http://www.zollerenterprizes.com/brownsfootballtalk/forums/topic/its-johnny-time/But with a slightly different focus.
Also figured more topics = more pages.
I think the reasons are simple.
1) He’s a team leader.
2) He’s led this team to its best record in 7 years.
3) Mainly though he’s proven that if we can have a decent running game he can get us a win. That’s worth expanding on.In 3 of the last 4 games we have not run well at all. That directly relates to the loss of all-pro center Alex Mack. He’s not hiking the ball and we struggle to run up the gut, which is where we got a lot of our yards early this season. Ever since he went down our RB’s have averaged less than 100 yards per game. That’s compared to averaging over 150 yards before he went down. With Alex Mack at center we’re 6-3. Without him we’re 1-3. While Hoyer’s play has not been good, he wasn’t the main problem. I see his struggles as a symptom of our inability to control the line of scrimmage.
That is the argument I’d make for keeping Hoyer as starter.
I’d counter that by saying I think his body language has deteriorated for the past four weeks to the point I’d say he doesn’t look like a leader anymore. Dejected and pouty on the sidelines, shoulders slumped between plays.
I’d also turn your statement around and say Hoyer has proven that, if the running game gets take away and his line has a bad game, he can’t kick it into the next gear and carry the team in his shoulders. That’s the difference between a starter and a journeyman. The difference between Aaron Rodgers putting up big numbers and Ryan Fitzpatrick doing the same.
I’d counter that by saying I think his body language has deteriorated for the past four weeks to the point I’d say he doesn’t look like a leader anymore. Dejected and pouty on the sidelines, shoulders slumped between plays.
Excellent point.
People always forget that Hoyer had 3 game films on him before starting this year. It just takes one defense coordinator to pick up on Hoyer, and guess what, he becomes predictable.
Hue Jackson is a loser.
@thedude is it that they figured out Hoyer or did they figure out Shanahan? He’s been very predictable. In that Jags debacle one of the picks happened when we ran the exact same play action play to the TE two times in a row. His playcalls have become very predictable.
I also believe guys have been in the wrong spot multiple times. I believe it’s been a combination of Shanahan 4 game streak of horrific playcalls mixed with guys in the wrong position and Hoyer being off his game.
Freedom!!!
@soup I’d say most of the above, but we’ll find out on Sunday what % of the problem was Shanny.
I will say, to my eye, Hoyer has not been going through his progressions, in which case it’s hard to evaluate whether his passing plays are predictable without coaching tape to evaluate the coverage.
I think some times you guys get too caught up in coordinators.
Guys to get to the NFL, you are pretty damn good. Think of how many people are in this country. Think of how many x-nfl players ran these plays or no them like the palm of their hands.
The thing is the game really hasn’t evolved too much more in the 2000’s. It is a passing games with pocket passing. It has been proven that qb’s on their feet are not championship caliber, but sometimes one leaks through for a year.
This is where it gets tricky guys. The best qb’s are always guys who catch their opponents on their toes. Manning has been running the same plays for 20 years. He keeps players guessing and has his receivers running crisp routes. If you ask anybody who has played with manning or coached him (and same with Brady) they will tell you one thing – the games are easy – the practices is the livelyhood of the program.
Browns have been terrible for so long because nobody puts in the extra effort.
Hue Jackson is a loser.
I think some times you guys get too caught up in coordinators.
I think most people don’t put enough stock in them. Situational play calling is key to winning in the NFL.
The best qb’s are always guys who catch their opponents on their toes. Manning has been running the same plays for 20 years. [b]He keeps players guessing and has his receivers running crisp routes.[/b] If you ask anybody who has played with manning or coached him (and same with Brady) they will tell you one thing – [b]the games are easy[/b] – the practices is the livelyhood of the program.
Browns have been terrible for so long because nobody puts in the extra effort.You have one of the keys of why Hoyer hasn’t been successful lately. Our WR haven’t been running crisp or the right routes. One of the 3rd downs last week the ball went into no man’s land – Gordon stopped his route short of where Hoyer wanted him. We had 2 players in the same spot on the red zone pick. Those are things to pay attention to that are out of the QBs hands. It’s going to be really interesting this week to see how the WR respond route wise.
As for the games being easy – this takes me back to why I don’t like Shanahan. He makes the game harder than it is. I’ll bring it up again – Q4, 5 minutes left – you have 1st and goal from the 6. Your RB is getting a legit 7 YPC and already has 2 TDs. The simple thing to do is hand it off and get the 3rd TD. The hard thing? Throw a pass where too much can go wrong. The situation dictated a run – he went complicated for the pass.
Freedom!!!
I feel like you are trying to write a resume for Maurice Carthon.
I don’t have to write a resume, he has a full coloring book to prove it.
Hue Jackson is a loser.
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